I have seen a few tribute GT cars that are great, but you all know me. I really love doing the obscure.

I have access to some aircraft cases and was thinking about taking 2 IO540s and adding another bank of pistons to one. Yes machining the cases, welding it all up and same with the crank. Wouldn't be cheap, or easy. But if I could make the motor, I could do the rest.

Anyone know what the displacement was ?

Or any other specs

3 liters... 300bhp

Although I believe there was also a 2.1 liter turbocharged version that had approx 4-500 bhp

But I could be wrong.

You're insane!


I like it.

It was the 908 race engine and 908 trans. Since the 908 was already mid engined, it fit really well - once Porsche moved the trunk firewall. Using an aircraft engine will be more work than Porsche had to do since you have to fit everything around the engine, adapt a trans, clutch, headers, etc. and then you don’t really see anything in a 914 engine bay.

I do want to do a silver 914-8 tribute but just exterior and interior. I’ll be happy with a six in the engine bay.

No, but it has been done with VW engines. In fact IIRC young Emerson Fittipaldi did this when he was still an up and comer racer in Brazil.

Why I say no is because aircraft and automotive engines are very different. Aircraft engines spin at slow speeds, 3000rpm redline, where they make the HP is with very long strokes and big pistons, 0-540 is 130.2 piston X 111.1mm stroke.

Automotive engines use much smaller bore and stroke, and a higher 6000 and up RPM, in the case of the 908, 85mm bore X 66mm stroke with a peak power of 370hp at 8400rpm.
It would be easier to weld two VW T1 engines together and then use SCAT split port heads.

But then the engine is too freaking long...and for the coin you spend on custom machining you could likely have a real nice /6 conversion.

The IO-540 was designed with a redline of 2700 RPM. Not only are you talking about welding in a case and crankshaft, but also completely redesigning the engine from the inside out.

So, yeah, you're off your rocker.

You're *far* better off trying to find an actual 908 engine...

Emerson Fittipaldi, flat 8 VW engine.
https://jalopnik.com/emerson-fittipaldis-do...-beetle-5799726

Edit: correction, I was a bit off, this was two engines coupled together.

Here you go

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4389012

my new favorite pic.... porsche 8cyl
911 based

It's interesting though, I never noticed that they had moved the firewall back on the 914-8 until just now. The picture always seemed a bit off but I couldn't put my finger on what was different.

The cheapest way to do this would be to use a Tatra V8 air cooled engine.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao5OF7EXDcw



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFXDgrLtNWo

Do we have to crank start it every time? Seems about right

Two 2.2 hot rodded VW Beetle engines in a 1100 lb Beetle chassis. 400+ HP and it had a swing axle suspension and DRUM BRAKES!!!!!

And you think I am crazy for building my 4.0L 914. This makes me look like a piker.......

Just do a really well done V8 conversion. No one will question your sanity except those of us who know you personally. as far as the other is concerned, you practically have an in-house machine shop now so...

No they are electric start, but it's a 1930's Czech design, back when the batteries weren't so reliable. There's another YT vid with a guy starting the engine with a tie down strap.

Holy cow...!

I agree, a LS alunimum engine would be my choice, I've been thinking about doing this to a 996.

Why sell yourself short at 'just' an 8? If you're gonna be a bear, be a grizzly.......

You might have add a couple feet to the 914 for this...

so much a better engine...

I think the quad headlights would be far out..
the body sure looks tortured in this pic

If you are really thinking about fabbing 2 more cylinders onto an Lycoming IO-540, know that there is an flat 8 Lycoming already; the IO-720. Piper built 148 Comanche 400's using this engine. Hell of a plane.

http://www.914world.com/specs/prototypes.php



As mentioned above already, you can weld together two /4 cases and make it a 4112 ...

Totally forgot about that one. They used it in the Pawnee Brave cropduster, too; bet there's a few of those in salvage yards somewhere...

Using the 911 Aluminum case as your base case would be better, independent cylinder heads, you would just need new crank, cams, cam towers, valve covers, gaskets, etc.....

But that puts you are 5.3 liters if you do it right. That is taking the 4.0L engine that is 0.666666666 liters per cylinder and multiplying it by 8.

Yes @ClayPerrine engine has the number of the beast in ever cylinder.

I am sure now that Rod Emory is having his 911-4 engines built, the P.N.W. has a bunch of 1 cylinder case halves lying around.

NOT!

Rothsports builds the engine for Rod Emory @Cary

I figure to get the 911-4 engines they put them in a big washing machine and wash them on hot, then transfer in the dryer for top secret number of minutes and it is shrunk to a -4

Thats how it works for my jeans

How about a motor from the Ferrari 512BB? It's a flat 12 and makes similar power. Might be easier to find than a 908 motor. What a beast it would be....

If you go through all the trouble to make a tribute of the 914/8, you gotta use a motor that is based on a Porsche engine.

Otherwise, it's just another conversion ...

About 19 years ago I replicated the 914-8 Oil cooler opening when I shoehorned a 3.2 L Motronic motor into my car at home in my garage. As I cut the opening for the oil cooler on the factory sheet metal I was able to break bend a flap of metal backwards to add rigidity and I also was able to retain the factory tow hook underneath the trunk by adding vertical support ribs back onto the bottom of the trunk.


Click to view attachment

Maybe partner with Emory on an idea like this?

Didn't someone in Europe do an 8cyl T4 many years ago ?.

Yes
There's a grainy vid of it on YT drag racing, there're pic's of it, but I don't have time to look. It's a guy in Sweden, 80's or early 90's I think it was in Hot VW's Magazine.

The picture appears to be 2 1/2 engines welded together.
That's some special welding.

https://oppositelock.kinja.com/if-vw-made-a...-vid-1637484786

I thought they were welded but that article I posted said they were 2 engines coupled together.
Also said it used weber carbs (IDA ) that would have been fun to sync.

Mueller found it...
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?s=&...t&p=2155656

Cool idea, but there's some huge hurdles to overcome.

The 8 cyl engines were dual overhead cam, so welding together two pushrod cases doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Nor does a Lycoming, for reasons cited earlier, ie go through a lot of time, trouble and expense for an engine that'll turn a half the rpm's of a hot rod flat 6.

If you really, really wanted to do that, it would be better to source a real Porsche flat 8, providing you want to trade in your King Air for an engine

People in the dirt country couple engines all the time. We make 1000s of HP with them.

Many ways of coupling two engines together and making it work.

Drag racers did it back in the 60s also.

Hell if you want, build it so it looks like it has 8 cylinders and run 6. Most people would never know.

You can make it look it it has a 908 engine, use a program to match the recording via the rev range, and then run a couple of drill motors.

If your going to do it, do it right get a Porsche engine, Or get some hunks of billet a 3D model of a 908 case, and a 5 axis CNC and start making some chips fly. Cylinders and heads are easy. 911 Parts. Model out the cam towers, and all the other odds and ends, CNC away. At that point make it better than it was.

This is not rocket science, real question is how much are you willing to spend to build a tribute car?

In a few months we could 3D print this part out of SS, Ti, Al, CoMo, or an Alloy. It just takes some time and a Direct Metal Laser Sintering machine large enough to make the parts. You can then go back and machine final finishes for bearing seats, etc... Cranks I would use Billet, not sure I am trueing DMLS on these parts. Cams would be the same.

I will gladly do it for you, just need the seed money and we will start the build process, I have seen some dumber things get funded with much less likely chance of being produced. Heck I have a chassis right here to start with, how close of a tribute do you want?

Would it be easier to have Miles (Redshift) dust off his patented Break In and Bust Out B plan and alter it to sneak into the Porsche museum and snag the engine from the real thing?

totally possible just takes $$$. You could work with one of these guys that are producing new 911 cases.
https://www.taorminaracingdesigns.com/
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-...c-racing-7.html

Both are making new cases one is focused on 2.0 the other 3.6. CNC out of billet is only a cad file away.
Marine crank could make the crankshaft.
heads would be easy as the are individual standard 911
Weld up some cam towers
special cams.
All possible

John

100% Billet 12,500 Noonan
https://noonanrace.com/pages/contact-us
https://www.facebook.com/NoonanRaceEngineer...29072154492193/

Best solution is 2 polo motors coupled.. Any GA lycoming is not a good solution.. Just designed around low rpm high TQ.

Visual Clone, wolf coat on a sheep... quad eyes

908 replica engine group buy anyone?

the easiest way is a billet block, custom extended crank and cams. Fab up an intake and exhaust and you're ready to go.

I really like that IO-720 but the price

You would still need to shorten the stroke to increase.the RPM range. Welding a Porsche case would be way cheaper. You could use the 720 crank throw positioning as the start to have a crank machined. Same with the cam lobe positioning.

The case is the easy part. It's the crank and cam that pose the challenge.

What you all are missing is the motor as an aircraft engine is set up for low rpm. While the displacement is large for the pistons. The rpm is a function of crank rod and cam. The case makes no real difference it’s just that. Lubrication would have to be addressed also. But from a cost standpoint the T2 case will be cheaper, probably a better candidate. Still, as Andy said. Unless you make the 8 at least as close as you can to factory, why bother?

Give Polo a call, maybe he wants a project to bookend with his beautiful motor!

Front 2/3rds of a Corvair case and rear 2/3rds of a Corvair case would make a flat fan c. 4 litre horizontally opposed 8 cylinder engine. Corvair cases are cheap c.f Porsche cases.

Rick,
I disagree.... the crank would be the easy part, just time consuming. Get a bunch of 911 cranks, and machine them into pieces that can be bolted together to make any firing order you want. I would use the late 908 firing order. The early one had problems with third order harmonics.

The cases would be harder. You have to cut two cases and weld the two half cases together. You need to put little alignment sleeves in all the oil galleries to keep them aligned. And you have to use 3.0 SC cases or newer to make them. Welding magnesium cases frightens me.

You also have to extend the cam carriers like you did for the case. Then, to make the cams, you get two pairs, of cams, cut up into pieces. Assemble and time the front lobes, then add the next one back, time it, and tack weld it. Do the same until each cylinder is timed, and the cam is tack welded. Pull it apart, then finish weld the cams, or send them off to be duplicated as a solid cam.

Sounds easy.

Totally get it. My former life as and aircraft engine rebuilder helped me to get a really good understanding of the limitations..

Your right on though..